Network manoeuvres and the art of programming
In Part 2 of an interview with TV Tonight, programmer David Mott admits industry cynicism on MasterChef rattled him, and explains how 9AM with David & Kim is a victim of network programming.
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In the second of a 2-part interview with TEN’s programmer, David Mott admits to apprehensions with his commissioning of MasterChef Australia. The apathy shown to the idea when it was announced was enough to make him question his decision. Thankfully for everyone, it was a move that has paid off enormously.
Mott says the industry was cynical, and so was the public.
“We were concerned about Masterchef, and many of your (TV Tonight) forums were quite critical when we commissioned it. It was an interesting read at the time. It made us think, ‘ooh gee have we made the right decision?’
“It was one of those things that made us think this could actually skew too old for us. We really believed in the format but were concerned that it was not going to be a really young show, so it had to feed the families, so to speak.
“But we felt food united everyone, and was something everyone did together.”
TEN was mindful of how the show was packaged, from the opening title music to diversity in the cast. Along with Talkin’ ‘Bout Your Generation, the show has brought in older viewers and helped score demographic wins. After years of pursuing younger viewers it is somewhat ironic TEN soars thanks to adding older viewers to the mix.
“It’s been a benefit for us but is it a change in philosophy for the network? No. 18-49 first, 25-54 second. We’re not ignoring 16-39 but we knew we had to broaden our market.”
So could it be a signal to commission more shows skewing towards older viewers? Not so fast.
“Not skewing older, but skewing more towards the family environment,” he explains. “We’ve been very clear on that. The family environment brings in more people in front of the TV. So we’re not about to commission shows that bring in viewers that are 55+, forget it. I’ll leave that to the Seven Network. They seem to be good at it.”
Mott is also adamant that demographics, not total viewers, are where it’s at, expressing some frustration at media reporting of total viewers.
“Ask any media buyer, they don’t buy All People, they buy individual shows with a demographic fit,” he said. “Winning demos we love. Coming second (in total people), couldn’t care less. Could. Not. Give. A rat’s arse. It’s all very good, but y’know what? It doesn’t mean a thing.”
Meanwhile the 6pm timeslot as an ongoing problem, but Mott says the network has no plans to take on rival networks in news and current affairs in that timeslot.
“But if you look at the 7-10:30 area, invariably we are #1 in total people. And so we recognise that early evening area is a struggle for us.”
While even a win in total people between 7-10:30 is debatable, what is rock solid is the success of MasterChef Australia. Mott admits its growing success saw him make some strategic programming manoeuvres.
“It became a beast, it became a monster. I increased the hours a bit. I extended Wednesday to take on Thank God You’re Here and things like that. We increased their work volume as well and the team embraced the change. They worked their arses off,” he said.
“It’s been one of those great experiences in television that don’t come around everyday. From commissioning, to question marks over whether we should do it, have we made the right decision, to getting the format strategically right, the casting, the judges, and then the ratings results. And to see a quote saying ‘the MasterChef effect.’ It’s not just a show it’s an ‘effect’ on Australian culture.
“It’s very hard to find formats that you can play five days a week, but that can actually strike a chord with the Australian psyche.”
The idea for the show had been brewing within TEN, but Mott also explored the idea of an Australian version of The Apprentice as a stripped format -a title Nine has since acquired.
“We looked at The Apprentice. But then Seven launched the UK version on the back of the Olympics and it just died a million deaths. We got a bit nervous about it, and the UK version is very good. We actually think The Apprentice format has been tried here and it’s not necessarily going to make it.
“We looked at renovation shows, and we looked at shows that we thought could engage an audience every night. And we did look at MasterChef. As soon as we announced the end of Big Brother, Mark and Carl (Fennessy from FremantleMedia) were on the phone saying, ‘listen dunno what your plans are, but we reckon there’s something in MasterChef.'”
It was a mutual enthusiasm.
Now as the show ramps up to its finale, TEN is finalising its celebrity version, which will run one hour a week for 10 weeks from October. The format is expected to include a ’round robin’ of varying celebrities in separate heats who graduate to a semi final. While he wouldn’t be drawn on names yet, Mott insists the tone will still be on serious cooking and passion.
“It’s very important that we see some amazing dishes being cooked by people that you’re familiar with, but you never thought they’d be familiar with food. So it is that classic fish out of water.
“We’ve been quite blown away by the diversity of people who’ve actually put their hand up who want to be a part of it. Including quite a few people from other networks,” he said.
“One thing I’ve always done is support people from other networks appearing on our network, but other networks don’t seem to have the same feeling.”
Next year TEN plans a second MasterChef series from April followed by another variation in format in the second half of the year -the format allows for different casts.
“We might do a professionals version or a teen version. We’ll always do one other shorter run but it might not be celebrities.”
Meanwhile, as Nine announces its forthcoming GO! channel, TEN is very happy, thankyou, with the momentum of ONE. Mott says while it has achieved a result from a numbers point of view, the network is always looking forward, hinting at further multi-channelling in the future.
“Legislation says we can have 3 channels each and obviously there’s always those discussions internally about what we will do. At the moment we’re very happy with what we’ve got with ONE going forward.”
When it comes to kids’ programming, TEN has been deliberately strategic, moving all its C and pre-school programming to breakfast, in order to free up its afternoons. Both parts of the day are available to networks for children’s programming under ACMA regulations.
“If you look between 3 -5 where the others are forced to put C and pre-school programmes, we’ve completely opened up that area,” he said.
“Stronger ratings in the afternoon, leading into primetime enable you to maximise your return with your revenue, but also help from a promo point of view, pushing your shows into primetime.
“The only downside to that equation is the pressure it puts on the 9AM team to not have any lead-in whatsoever.”
9AM with David and Kim is thumped on a daily basis by both The Morning Show and Mornings with Kerri-Anne. Mott says the content is good but knows it is a victim of programming.
“The biggest issue is we don’t have a lead in. And that’s a conscious decision we’ve made. We could have gone into breakfast television but we elected not to.”
Another perplexing programming decision is the slating of the daily serial Out of the Blue into a weekly slot at 5:30pm Sundays. Here, the answer was blunt: it’s just for drama points.
“Monday to Friday at 6:00 is G territory, which is curious given its news content on the other channels. Whereas on weekends it’s PG. So that did preclude us from running it at 6:00 weekdays. So it sitting there and yes it is purely there to achieve the drama quota points. It will playout. Clearly it won’t be renewed,” he admits.
“Having said that we’re investing in Australian drama with Rush, Neighbours, (plus telemovies) Hawke and Caroline Byrne.
38 Responses
@David:
Maybe in future if you get time to, do the demos once a week in the weekly ratings report for the top 10 shows of the week maybe?
Thanks to 10 not doing the same as 7 and 9, there are options for kids in the morning – who get left out by breakfast shows, and options for adults in the afternoon, leaving kids shows on 7 and 9 3.30 – 4.30.
9AM does have much better interviews than its 2 competitors, as Kim is a qualified professional journalist, but the show is sabotaged by all the moronic advertorials, which is the only reason Ten basically still keep it on air (with the abysmal national ratings it garners) as it makes them money.
“We looked at The Apprentice. But then Seven launched the UK version on the back of the Olympics and it just died a million deaths. . . . We actually think The Apprentice format has been tried here and it’s not necessarily going to make it.”
if only gyngel had such logical thinking powers.
That percentage for advertising in prime time could be higher, I was only going on memory…but needless to say most of the advertising is sold from 6pm-10.30pm and you only need to watch tv after 10.30pm to realize that.
Brodie, spin is when a network constantly alters the figures to their own advantage. Spin is when Nine are not doing well from February to July, so they report January to July, or when Seven are not doing well in prime time so they include daytime in their ratings. And then they change their reporting depending on their results. Ten do not do that. They report 6pm-10.30pm figures with a focus on the under 50s…and that’s because that is how they run their business. They are consistent in their reporting and have been for more than ten years. It is the media that would have you believe that total people figures from 6pm-midnight are the most important figures of all, which, when you really think about it, doesn’t make any sense. What advertiser would only look at total people?
As far as the media is concerned, Ten is irrelevant, and the ratings are usually a 2 horse race between Seven and Nine. However, with Masterchef recently getting huge total people figures, and Ten winning a few nights, the media are now taking notice of Ten. Ten cannot ignore the total people figures because they are such a focus for the media and people who follow the ratings, but what Mott is saying is, as far as he and the Ten network are concerned, total people results mean absolutely nothing.
People seem to conveniently forget that ratings only exist for advertisers.
9AM is unwatchable because of the long ads ! A waste of talent .They do great interviews but then go into 5 min advertorials which are unwatchable , same ones day after day .
Janey, It’s hardly surprising around 80% of advertising is sold between 6pm – 10.30pm, considering those 4.5 hours actually occupy 75% of primetime. I don’t really see what your point is there, that is a fairly evenly weighted percentage throughout the night, hence 10.30 onwards is just as important.
The fact Ten only report on 6pm – 10.30pm is spin, just as Seven & Nine’s reports have been in the past. These varying reports and percentages, with varying winners depending on “Ten’s prime time 6pm – 10.30pm” and the official 6pm – midnight primetime, just leads to confusion. So it’s no wonder the media don’t report on these varying demos, separating fact from network spin
Mott may not like the fact demos aren’t reported in the media, but Ten’s fabricated reporting is a large contributor to this notion.
I would happily run demos if I received consistent, comprehensive figures in a format that doesn’t involve me sitting there and re-typing them all day. Most of the ones I receive are just the tip of the iceberg sent for strategic reasons. I’m not just going to run 18-49 only or 25-54 only between the hours of X and Z -it’s rubbish.
treasure, you need to think about what you’ve just written…
“Between 9am and 6pm, they chase the elderly!”
Yes, because all the youth are either at school/uni/work. The elderly (we’ll say they’re the 55+, so most of which are above the retirement age) are mostly retired (I use this generally, of course) and have much more time to watch TV during the day. Appealing to the youth when there are absolutely none of them there (perhaps a few housewives, but there are a lot of mothers who now work, etc.) is silly. There’s no point trying to appeal to them if they’re not there in the first place.
“If you count the hours, Ten’s 24 hour programming is very responsive to the elderly audience. It’s really just prime time that’s 16-49. (which is interesting in itself, I’m late 20s, dad’s 49, and yet he never watches Ten).”
See my above reply. Of course it’s mostly prime time – everyone’s home then. Everyone’s finished school/uni/work/whatever. Guh, your post is ridiculous.
David and Kim is something I don’t consider because I am led in by breakfast shows (Sunrise leads me into The Morning Show on occasion).
It does need a lead in program, but there’s no point TEN doing a breakfast program when Sunrise and Today (both been around for years) have a huge audience and battle between each other.
I think Masterchef will become overused by the 4th installment in the 2nd half of next year – that’s what happens with these shows, people get over them – Big Brother comes to mind.
I think Masterchef would have failed if they’d stayed with the “nice judge mean judge” thing they were bordering on, during the earliest episodes, when they were winnowing down the hundreds to just twelve.
Once the proper competition began, and Matt Preston started to compliment and smile, it made it more entertaining.
Plus, it’s not about personalities and rivalries, it’s about cooking. A unique move amongst reality programming.
Brodie, Ten have been reporting and only care about the under 50s from 6pm-10.30pm for more than ten years now. They are not moving any goal posts. The official Oztam daily reports show 6pm-midnight as prime time, but something like 80% of advertising is sold from 6pm-10.30pm, and Ten have clearly stated in many interviews and press releases that’s why they only focus on that time. They are running a business and that is their business strategy for their clients. They are the most consistent network when reporting ratings IMO. Seven and Nine have reported many different times and demographics over the last ten years…just look at Nine’s reporting recently from January this year! A few years ago Seven were only reporting from 9am to midnight because it was the only positive story for them.
Ratings only exist so that advertisers can decide where to place their advertising, and yet most people who follow ratings seem to think there is only one figure that is worth mentioning and everything else is spin. As Mott said, total people is the least important figure that an advertiser would look at. If KFC want to target 16-24 years olds with their new campaign, they’re not going to advertise in Dancing With The Stars which may get 1.5 million total people, but less than 20% in 16-24 year olds. Advertisers buy shows that target the audience they are trying to reach…simple as that. Total people figures are a nice ego boost for any network and the media love to report them…but they don’t mean much to advertisers.
9AM is a better show. Much more intelligent guests and features. But, oh dear, I’m 55+. “So we’re not about to commission shows that bring in viewers that are 55+, forget it” (David Mott). Should I stop watching?
How many 55+ watch MasterChef, 5th Grader, Australian Idol, Talkin’ about Your Gen., Rush….? Well, a few in our house. And a telemovie on Bob Hawke will not bring in 55+ viewers ??
No celebrity Master Chef, I won’t watch it. The greatest thing about Master Chef is that the public can’t vote for the prettiest cook !
I feel sorry for the poor +55 demographic! And David Mott didn’t really talk about the split in Ten’s demographic. Between 9am and 6pm, they chase the elderly! Ten’s news isn’t sponsored by Australian Pensioners Insurance Agency because of its youth following! Same could be said of Law and Order.
If you count the hours, Ten’s 24 hour programming is very responsive to the elderly audience. It’s really just prime time that’s 16-49. (which is interesting in itself, I’m late 20s, dad’s 49, and yet he never watches Ten).
Masterchef is well produced, but its more of the same from Ten. Find a topic you can thrash out and schedule it to cover as many holes as possible.
As for the 7pm project, will be interesting. What happened to local news at 6 to cover the Simpsons? I guess this is doing exactly the same, but instead of local content it’s national, and hopefully funny.
Mott seems to be annoyed the media primarily report on total people. Perhaps if he stopped moving the goal posts, and reported on the official 6pm – midnight demographics like Nine and Seven there wouldn’t be half as much confusion, grey area, and spin in the numbers.
Hey David,
Love MasterChef, but I think talk of having a ‘Celebrity MasterChef’ is a really tacky idea. Please don’t ruin the show through overexposure and the introduction of C-list celebrities using MasterChef to advance their own media careers.
Leave the Neighbours starlets to work the tables at Lassiters (is it still going).
i love Out of the Blue – i wish it was given more of a chance, but i am grateful it is being shown at all and grateful for ten for keeping it on
i hope 10 dont bring in a breakfest show to lead into 9am. it’s a great show i reckon. it’s better than what 9 and 7 have
David & Kim is the best of the morning shows but only if you are capable of thinking and listening to longer interviews about real topics. Love em !
Loved the snide comment re Seven and the 55+ so true 🙂 That’s all Seven know! TEN and Nine really do understand that it’s only the under 55s that matter.
TEN are going great guns atm ,TBYG and MC are my two favorite new shows and it’s no surprise they are huge hits.
Thanks David for an interesting interview. I wonder if the problem of not having space for shows that suit small viewing audiences, but loyal viewers ….Out of the Blue etc…could be solved if these shows on One SD….rather than rebroadcasting One HD.
When David Mott refers to having permission to broadcast 3 channels maybe he’s hinting that down the track they’ll put shows with a loyal following that don’t rate highly on their third channel? He did say this was not on their immediate to-do list.
I don’t live in a capital city, but it seems strange to me that TEN shows the same programs in SD as HD. Why would you go to the extra expense to watch? My Philips LCD TV with external Philips STB seems to give as good a picture in SD as it does in HD.
Thanks for the interview again. Quite a strong statement from David Mott regarding demographics and ratings. But he did not answer the question: why was not OOTB shown at 7pm weeknights during last summer?
Thanks David, very interesting !
As Nine falls further into a black hole Ten is on a rapid climb as they are listening to what we the audience require and have faith in good Aussie content.
Thanks for asking about Out of the Blue. His dismissal of it is obviously disappointing for us fans but not surprising given the ratings it gets. I think that the PG rating just provides a convenient excuse really – Ten could come up with a more acceptable solution or simply make some cuts if they really were interested in supporting a great Aussie show.
My take on Ten’s treatment of the show has always been the money aspect. They were announcing how thrilled they were to have OOTB when the production costs were being paid by the BBC, but once the Beeb lost faith in the show, it was clear that arrangement wasn’t going to continue and the attitude quickly changed. Clearly they didn’t want to be left footing the bill for future episodes if it turned out to be a hit. It is much better than Neighbours!
Speaking of Neighbours, I’m not sure how that counts as Ten investing in Australian drama as he says, when the production costs are covered by Five?
Fair play to Ten over Masterchef, they obviously have a hit on their hands and have capitalised on it well.
LOL @ how he says it’s all about the demographics, not overall ratings, before going on to boast about their total numbers from 7-10.30.